Sunday, October 22, 2006

2-Hour Pow-Wow-Dr Mahathir/PM Abdullah in Official Residence, Putrajaya. Dr M satisfied, aired grievances & continues to criticize when necessary

UPDATE: Oct23 06;

It would be back to “square one” for Dr Mahathir after this so called “peace talk” meeting. The manner and tone in which the meeting was conducted as described by Dr Mahathir in his press conference would not be a “friendly one” as it looked like a one sided affair with him making his demands and stating his same old issues but now “directly” to Abdullah as he put it. He did almost all the talking and our poor Abdullah doing all the listening and taking down what were uttered. It would have been better to have a digital recording of the conversation using a camera with video/audio capability.

Haven’t the PM and all his yes men taken all the pains and through booklets to explain the same old issues? If the answers do not suit him, how would these “impossible demands” and differences be settled in the long run? Abdullah had hoped that sooner or later all these concerns will fade away but all the issues resurfaced intact without any compromise.

Dr Mahathir was not paying attention to his emotional communications and translations of thoughts, in this so called “4-eye meeting” with Abdullah. It was an “automatic response” for Dr Mahathir in the meeting that was motivated by his beliefs and he seemed unaware of the influence of his beliefs and perceptions of the same issues raised. Of course his beliefs are not absolute truth. Malaysia a “police state” under Abdullah?

Many of his TRUTHS - all of his TRUTHS - are mere BELIEFS. The belief systems that are strongest to him individually, he would call that a truth. He has been expressing them for months already and were within his focuses on a continuous basis. All his automatic responses that seemed to elude his notice and he identifies them merely as truths. Therefore, they are entirely unquestioned and challenged by others.

The problems and conflicts would remain as he wants to ARGUE and FIGHT over philosophical differences in solving the nation’s perceived problems in his own eyes. Even when other information comes which are more correct and more helpful, he would still cling and hold on to old beliefs, reject or doubt them because his ideas or theory seem contradictory to the new data.

And this is one of the problems we seen in our lives and in the world that has produced or given birth to so many things, such as hatred, discrimination and conflicts between neighbors, people and between nations.

= = = = = = = = = = = =Transcript of Dr Mahathir's press conference; October 22, 2006 23:54 PM Via STAR online

This is a transcript of the press conference with former prime minister Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad at his residence at The Mines Resort, just outside Kuala Lumpur, after his meeting with Prime Minister Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi on Sunday.

Former prime minister Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad at his residence at The Mines Resort

DR MAHATHIR: We met for two hours. My intention was to convey all my doubts. I managed to express all that was in my heart. All of it. After 20 minutes, he touched on a bit, only a few things, including his son’s (Kamaluddin) and (his son-in-law) Khairy’s (Jamaluddin) involvement and my allegation that we have a police state.
I said each time I am invited; the police will question and intimidate the people. He said this was not true. He disagreed that we have a police state. He also told me that since I have done this, I have become unpopular and he has lost popularity too because of my criticism and the people that have benefited are (former prime minister Datuk Seri) Anwar Ibrahim and Nik Aziz (Kelantan Mentri Besar and PAS spiritual adviser Datuk Nik Abdul Aziz Nik Mat).
There wasn’t much else. For me, my intention was to convey my views, and we will wait and see if there will be changes or not. I brought up and explained the bridge issue but there were no comments from him. Many other issues I brought up were not touched on but he noted everything in his little black book. All the time I was talking he was jotting down. It was thick. I hope following this meeting there will be some kind of action.

Q: Are you happy with the meeting?
A: I can't say I'm happy. I am satisfied that I have been able to say these things directly to him. People say that I have been making comments from outside, but now I have seen him. I also made it clear that I want to be free to make my criticisms. If I find that anything done is not good for the country, I will continue with my criticisms. I did explain that this block against my speaking to Umno is not good, not right. I have lost my civic right. Also the idea of postponing the Umno elections is not right. Although I had done it before, it was because the elections came one year before the general election. Now the general election is not even anytime soon, so there is no reason why the election of Umno’s office bearers should not be held.

Q: Was it a fruitful discussion?
A: To me it was worthwhile as I got to say it frankly, the way I had said it to the public also but the idea that if I have a grouse I go and tell him, it is not workable because people won't know why I have a grouse. So I have to explain why something is wrong.

Q: How did the Prime Minister react when you said you would continue criticising?
A: He didn’t say anything.

Q: How do you read that?
A: As far as I am concerned, if he doesn’t say anything, I will do it. Whether he says yes or no, I am going to continue. I am going to continue if I feel that something done is not beneficial to the country.

Q: Was it just between the two of you?
A: Yes, just the two of us. Nobody else.

Q: Did you get the replies to the issues you raised?
A: Not all. He mentioned his son's and son-in-law’s involvement and he said it is not right – that this accusation that they ring up people and all that, that is not true. But he wants to find out from them whether they did or not.

Q: Are you expecting any feedback?
A: I didn’t ask for any.

Q: Did the Prime Minister give you any assurance?
A: I didn’t ask for that. I was not there to argue. I just wanted explanations on the things that I am not happy about.

Q: What are you expecting after this?
A: We will see what happens.

Q: If they are not as you expect?
A: I reserve the right to comment and I also pointed out that in Umno there must have freedom to speak their minds. He is wrong not to allow Umno (members) to speak their minds.

Q: Was there anything you were unhappy about that was not raised?A: I raised everything, including (the fact) that his name appeared in the list of companies that dealt with the Oil-for-Food programme. He said he had nothing to do with that, that he simply wrote a letter to introduce this man who was married to his sister-in-law.

Q: Were a lot of the issues you raised answered?
A: No ... he didn’t answer much as there were two hours and I spoke for one-and-a-half hours. There was half an hour left and he touched on several issues and then he stopped, you see, so we went back.

Q: How did the meeting end?
A: It was very cordial. We shook hands.

Q: What was the tone of the meeting?
A: He listened.

Q: Were you able to put across your points to the Prime Minister?
A: Yes, I was able to explain why I am not happy with so many things, including Proton, the APs (approved permits) and (International Trade and Industry Minister Datuk Seri) Rafidah (Aziz).

Q: Will there be a follow-up?
A: It was not scheduled. I didn't say anything about it but he said it’d be good if I come and see him.

His final parting shot "It's up to him now. He knows what I feel unhappy about"

= = = = = = = = = =
the account from local NST
After the 'peace talks': Dr M states his stand; 23 Oct 2006 Farrah Naz Karim

KUALA LUMPUR: The protracted differences between Prime Minister Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi and Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad have only served to benefit their political opponents. Abdullah conveyed this point in his one-on-one meeting with his predecessor which took place for about two hours at his official residence in Putrajaya yesterday. Dr Mahathir said at a Press conference after the highly-anticipated meeting that Abdullah spoke about how both of them had lost their popularity as a result of the spat.
Dr Mahathir’s sons Datuk Mukhriz and Datuk Mokhzani were also present at the Press conference at his house in Seri Kembangan, near here. "He told me that since I have been criticising I have become very unpopular... that he too has lost popularity because of my criticisms and that the people that have benefited are (Datuk Seri) Anwar Ibrahim and (Datuk) Nik (Abdul) Aziz (Nik Mat) who have become more popular.
"There wasn’t much about anything else," he said. Dr Mahathir said while he had conveyed to Abdullah his grouses, he would "wait and see if there were changes". The former prime minister said he was satisfied that he had been able to say his piece directly to Abdullah, adding that he made it clear that he wanted to be free in making his criticisms.
The meeting, which became a talking point when it was first mentioned recently, was held under a cloak of secrecy and got nearly everyone guessing yesterday about the turn of events and the outcome. Journalists particularly were on an endless stakeout at the possible venues but yet most of them missed it when Dr Mahathir entered the Prime Minister’s official residence through a private entrance. Security guards said Dr Mahathir entered Seri Perdana at
3pm and left at 5.07pm. He left in a heavily-tinted black Mercedes bearing the registration number JCJ 3 and on his way out, noticed reporters waiting and smiled.
Dr Mahathir, who was seated up front, then gestured to the person driving to stop the car. The car stopped for 10 seconds to allow photographers to take their shots. The meeting was an initiative of Mubarak, the association of former elected representatives, who sought to see an end to the squabble between the two personalities. Answering questions later, Dr Mahathir said Abdullah in reacting to the issue of the involvement of his son Kamaluddin and son-in-law Khairy Jamaluddin, denied the allegations Dr Mahathir had made against them.
"He said the accusation that they ring up people and all that is not true ... but he wants to find out from them whether they did or not." At the meeting, Dr Mahathir also pointed out to Abdullah that it was not right to postpone the party elections even though he himself had done this before. "The general election is not anytime soon, hence, there was no reason for the election of Umno’s office bearers to be delayed." Dr Mahathir said he also expressed his displeasure at being prevented from speaking to Umno members.
He said Abdullah rebuffed his allegation that the country was a police state whereby each time he was invited to speak, the police would be called to question and instil fear in his audience. The issue of the cancelled bridge project which was to replace the Causeway, he said, was also raised although Abdullah offered no comments. Dr Mahathir said he also raised the issues of Proton, the AP and (International Trade and Industry Minister) Datuk Seri Rafidah Aziz.
Asked on the tone of discussions, Dr Mahathir said it was "cordial", adding that there was not much about anything else. "He (Abdullah) did not answer much, as there were two hours and I spoke for one and a half. "There was half an hour left and he touched on several issues and then he stopped... so we went back." On the possibility of another meeting, Dr Mahathir said it was not scheduled.

"I did not say anything about it but he said something that it would be good if I come and see him

and here is the account from Channel NewsAsia

Malaysia's Mahathir won't stop attacks on govt despite peace talks with PM

Posted: 22 October 2006 2127 hrs

KUALA LUMPUR - Malaysia's former premier Mahathir Mohamad refused Sunday to end his attacks on the government, despite talks with his successor which had raised hopes for a resolution to the damaging feud.

Mahathir met with Prime Minister Abdullah Ahmad Badawi for two hours Sunday to address the very public verbal brawling that has sent shockwaves through the ruling party and raised fears of government instability.

The feisty 82-year-old political veteran, who now publicly regrets handing the top job to Abdullah in 2003, described the atmosphere as "cordial" but indicated he was not pleased with the results.

"I can't say I am happy, I am satisfied I am able to say these things directly to him," Mahathir told reporters.

"I will continue to criticise if I feel something is done which is not beneficial to the country," he added.

Mahathir said he "stated all that was in my heart" during the meeting, and that Abdullah responded on most issues including allegations that his influential son-in-law is the power behind the throne.

He said Abdullah also addressed Mahathir's charges that his son had gained improperly from government contracts, and "my allegation that we have become a police state".

Mahathir said Abdullah told him that only opposition figures -- including ousted deputy premier Anwar Ibrahim who was sacked and jailed in 1998 and who is now making a political comeback -- benefited from the stream of criticisms.

"He said each time I do these things, I become more unpopular, and he also lost his popularity because of my criticism."

"But he recorded in his little book... all that I said, and it was quite thick. I hope that after this, there will be action that will be taken."

Abdullah and Mahathir last week agreed to the meeting at the urging of the United Malays National Organisation (UMNO) which has ruled Malaysia for the past four decades.

Mahathir, infuriated by the axing of projects conceived during his two decades in power, including an abandoned proposal to build a new bridge to Singapore, has accused Abdullah of incompetence, nepotism and corruption.

The peace talks came as a surprise following months of rhetoric from Mahathir, who has complained he is now a pariah in the party he once ruled with an iron fist.

The meeting was hailed as a valuable opportunity to thrash out their differences in private, but some political figures have said they fear the fractures are too deep to be quickly resolved. - AFP/ir

= = = == = = =

Chronology Relating To Spats Between Dr Mahathir And Abdullah

KUALA LUMPUR, Oct 22 (Bernama) -- Prime Minister Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi and his predecessor Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad met Sunday after months of public spats between them. It all started when the former premier raised several issues, including the issuance of approved permits and the fate of national car manufacturer, Proton. The government's explanations failed to satisfy Dr Mahathir. The conflict heightened after Abdullah on April 12 announced the cancellation of the bridge project to replace the Johor Causeway.

Following are the chronology of events after the bridge project was scrapped.

* April 27 - Dr Mahathir gave a 16-point reasoning for the bridge's construction after he could not accept the government's reasoning for calling off the project.

* May 14 - Dr Mahathir said his opinion differed with the government's only on the bridge's cancellation.

* May 28 - Abdullah met Dr Mahathir in Tokyo but no issues were discussed.

* June 9 - Dr Mahathir criticised Abdullah's administration and said that he was only seeking answers to his earlier questions.

* July 14 - Dr Mahathir hurled allegations over the cancellation of the bridge project, forcing the government to declassify several confidential documents and made them public.

* July 19 - Abdullah said he had no problems with Dr Mahathir despite the latter's criticisms.

* July 25 - Dr Mahathir admitted that Malacca Yang di-Pertua Negeri Tun Khalil Yaakob met him. Khalil was said to be the mediator between Abdullah and Dr Mahathir.

* July 28 - There were talks that Dr Mahathir wanted to be prime minister again but he flatly denied this.

* July 28 - Dr Mahathir was attacked by pepper spray on his visit to Kelantan.

* Aug 8 - Dr Mahathir again denied talks that he was eyeing the prime minister's post.

* Aug 9 - Dr Mahathir said he would continue to seek answers from the government, two days after Abdullah appeared in a television interview to refute allegations of nepotism and cronyism.

* Aug 11 - Perak Ex-Elected Reps Association (Mubarak) planned to arrange a meeting between Abdullah and Dr Mahathir to settle their differences.

* Aug 13 - Abdullah refused to comment on a remark by Minister in the Prime Minister's Department Datuk Seri Mohamed Nazri Aziz that Dr Mahathir's incessant attacks on the government were aimed at bringing him down.

* Sept 11 - Dr Mahathir, who failed in his bid to be a Kubang Pasu Umno division delegate to the party's general assembly in November, blamed it on corruption.

* Sept 12 - Deputy Prime Minister Datuk Seri Najib Razak asked Dr Mahathir to lodge a complaint with the Umno disciplinary committee on his allegation of corruption in the Kubang Pasu election.

* Oct 18 - Abdullah and Dr Mahathir agreed to meet before Aidilfitri.

* Oct 22 - They met at the prime minister's official residence in Putrajaya.
= = = = = = =End of UPDATE

The long awaited peace talks finally took place on Sunday, 22nd October 2006.
According to sources the former Prime Minister Dr Mahathir said the meeting was worthwhile as he managed to voice out his dissatisfactions including issues concerning Datuk Seri Abdullah’s son-in-law Khairy Jamalluddin.

However, Tun Mahathir also said that he would continue to criticize the administration if he is not satisfied with any decision or action taken by the government.
The closed door meeting took place at PM Datus Seri Abdullah’s official residence and concluded at 5.30pm. Tub Dr Mahathir left the residence waving and smiling and did not stop to give any comments to the waiting media.

= = = = = =
Abdullah, Dr M Meet At Seri Perdanal; October 22, 2006 18:29 PM
PUTRAJAYA, Oct 22 (Bernama) -- The eagerly- awaited meeting between Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi and his predecessor Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad took place at the prime minister's official residence "Seri Perdana" here Sunday.

The Official residence Seri Perdana

It could not be ascertained when exactly he entered the building although it is believed he did so at about 3pm. Dr Mahathir had said he would tell Abdullah about "all his grievances". The former prime minister who led the country for 22 years before stepping down in 2003 has over the past few months criticised Abdullah for, among others, cancelling the half-bridge project to Singapore and reversing some of his policies.

The meeting was mooted by Mubarak, the council of former elected representatives.
Abdullah said on Wednesday he was agreeable to a "one-on-one" meeting with Dr Mahathir and that there would be no mediators and no conditions set. The prime minister said this a day after Dr Mahathir said he was prepared to sit down with his successor and air his grievances. The press went on a wild goose chase today as they tried to find out the exact location and time of the meeting. A few of them waited at the side and main entrances of Seri Perdana while others rushed to Abdullah's private residence nearby.

The heavily tinted Black Mercedes (JCJ 3) exiting from the residence. Dr M refused to stop & give any comments on the meeting

Another group waited at the Umno headquarters at the Putra World Trade Centre in Kuala Lumpur. Upon hearing word that Dr Mahathir was at Seri Perdana, everybody rushed there and waited at the various entry and exit points before the black car emerged with Dr Mahathir inside.
= = = = = =
and here is the STAR update;Sunday October 22, 2006
BELOW: Bunch of reporters were waiting at the wrong places and given the "wild goose chase" to loacte the venue of meeting on Sunday October 22, 2006

PM and Dr Mahathir met at Seri Perdana in Putrajaya; Sunday October 22, 2006

News Update by The Star News Desk
PUTRAJAYA: The much-awaited meeting between Prime Minister Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi and Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad took place at Seri Perdana here Sunday. Dr Mahathir was seen leaving the Prime Minister's official residence at 5.10pm. His car stopped at the gates and the former Prime Minister smiled and posed for the hordes of Press photographers waiting there. However, he did not speak to reporters who were there. Details of the meeting are still unclear at present. Abdullah and Dr Mahathir had agreed to meet before Hari Raya Aidilfitri to discuss issues raised by the former prime minister. Dr Mahathir had openly criticised Abdullah for reversing some of his policies including scrapping the "crooked bridge" project to replace the Johor Causeway linking Malaysia and Singapore. There are no conditions or mediators for the meeting proposed by Mubarak, the former elected representatives' council. Abdullah had confirmed that he would meet Dr Mahathir before Hari Raya. Dr Mahathir had said he would raise again the issues that he had been keeping in his heart since he left the government.
= = = = = =
Background of meeting From The Star

All ready for ‘meeting of the year’ ;; Sunday October 22, 2006
The fact that the Prime Minister and Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad are willing to meet after months of a war of words has brought relief as well as hope for a calmer political climate, writes JOCELINE TAN. SOME have called it smoking the peace pipe, except that the Prime Minister and Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad do not smoke. And it is definitely not going to turn into golf diplomacy because golf has never been the game of the former premier. As such, the face-to-face between Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi and

Dr Mahathir will simply have to be described as a meeting but it is already known as the “meeting of the year” as far as Umno members are concerned.
HIGHLY-AWAITED MEETING: Will the sit-and-talk between Abdullah and Dr Mahathir pave the way to smoother ties and understanding between them? That is how much weight the Umno fraternity has placed on the talks. They are not expecting the hostilities of the past months to evaporate overnight, but they are just glad the two are finally talking. “It will cool down the situation and clear the air. I feel very positive about it,” said Datuk Sharkar Shamsuddin, who is Pahang Umno information head. For more than a month now, the air has been filled with talk that a meeting was on the cards. But party secretary-general and Home Minister Datuk Seri Radzi Sheikh Ahmad would just smile his mysterious Mona Lisa smile whenever anyone asked him.

Even fellow Cabinet colleague Datuk Zainuddin Maidin could not coax anything out of Radzi. “He just smiled, refused to say yes or no,” Zainuddin recalled. Apparently, only a small group has been privy to the arrangements. Not long after the first stillborn attempt at a meeting, the association of former wakil rakyat or Mubarak mooted a second meeting and there was a string of highly discreet to-and-fros between them and Radzi.

The Mubarak group struck a chord with both sides because they were seen as the group with the least vested interest: they did not harbour ulterior ambitions and would not take advantage of the situation. As such, they had the moral push that other well-wishers lacked. But the key Mubarak personality in this particular affair also happens

to be one of the most well-regarded veteran figures in Umno, namelyTan Sri Azahari Taib, 83, from Kedah. The octogenarian, just a year older than Dr Mahathir, was decidedly coy when asked about his role in facilitating the meeting. “You are talking about the lion and the tiger. I am a nobody, just a small fry around them,” he said in his typical jocular way. But this “small fry” goes back a long way with Dr Mahathir as well as Abdullah.

The small-sized and sprightly Azahari was a contemporary of the Prime Minister's late father and sometimes still refers to Abdullah as “the young fellow”. He has known Dr Mahathir since they were teenagers or, as he put it, “since the Japanese Occupation.”
He knew Mahathir by his nickname, 'Det', but after the latter graduated as a medical doctor, Azahari took to calling him “Doctorrr,” often rolling the “r” in the title. Both Azahari and Radzi were the main facilitators at the stage of getting the nod from both men.
Once they got the nod, the arrangements went to a new level that also saw the two sons of the two men helping to work out the nitty-gritty of their fathers' schedules. Azahari: Veteran Umno figure from Kedah was key in mooting the meeting Also, little known to everyone, Dr Mahathir had actually agreed to the meeting even before the outcome of the Kubang Pasu affair. His second son Mokhzani was asked to go to Kedah to talk to his father. Apparently, Dr Mahathir said, “okay,” with quite little persuasion.

An incredible amount of effort has gone into arranging this seemingly straightforward meeting. If anythingg, it shows how determined people in Umno and the Government are about resolving the fallout. They think it has gone on too long. Although Dr Mahathir's quarrel with Abdullah began in June this year, his critique of the administration began last year over the AP issue and the national automotive policy.

His supporters insist he only wants to see the issues addressed and resolved but his attacks have, at times, been so personal that they left some gasping.“It's been so unsettling for us and that's not only because I come from the same state as Tun Mahathir. We look up to both men and we hope they won't only shake hands but also come to terms with each other,” said Puteri Umno treasurer Suraya Yaakob. Despite all the criticism, said think-tank head Razak Baginda, Abdullah has held on. Dr Mahathir, on the other hand, has come a full circle.
“It would be tempting to say he is mellowing but the point is Dr Mahathir has not seen the sort of support he expected. He has taken his cause to different groups. There has been support but it has been nebulous rather than concrete. To stay relevant he has to come to the table,” said Razak. It has been a long, terrible year for both men and more so for Abdullah because he was the main target. As such his willingness to meet with Dr Mahathir is to be commended. Suraya: ‘We hope they will shake hands and come to terms with each other’ Not many people, as Umno supreme council member Datuk Shahrir Samad pointed out, would want to do that after the things said.

It says a lot of the nature of Pak Lah,” said Shahrir. Abdullah, sources said, is genuinely pleased about the face-to-face plan. He was been deeply troubled and hurt by the attacks and from no less than an iconic personality like Dr Mahathir. He dislikes the conflict and the tension and he wants to see a more stable political atmosphere in order to implement his policies. “When Umno is not stable, it affects everybody,” said Zainuddin. And although many welcomed the meeting, expectations about its outcome have ranged from optimism to scepticism. The more optimistic hope it will establish a direct line of communication between the two men so that they need not air their views in public. Dr Mahathir's end also has to accept that the issues raised cannot be resolved in one meeting. “It will take more effort and commitment than that. The two parties should work things out from there. Pak Lah should not think that it will lessen his position as the Prime Minister and Tun should not think it will curb his opportunity to be heard,” said a source close to the former premier.

Shahrir put it more bluntly: “You cannot go in expecting the PM to agree with everything. That's not going to happen.” Whichever way one may chose to view the meeting, it is a truce of sorts. And like all truces, there has to be a ceasefire. The humiliating public attacks ought to stop. “Tun Mahathir could have joined forces in advising the Government but he went and did it from the outer lane. I hope he will return to the inner lane,” said Razak.

Abdullah's administration needs to reciprocate where possible. It is possible that some of the administration's advisors misjudge d Dr Mahathir's deep sense of interest, involvement or even possessiveness over the state of affairs in the country and, more important, the extent to which he was prepared to go to defend his ideas. Those who worked with him would have understood it well enough and it came out rather clearly in his recent interview on Bloomberg. When the interviewer described Proton as his baby, Dr Mahathir, with a whad'yamean-kind-of-smile, interjected: “Everything in this country is like my baby after 22 years.” Said political insider Datuk Annuar Zaini: “For now, it's really between the two. I'm praying for the best because I represent the group who wants to see friendship between them. It's not impossible – they are breathing the same air, standing on the same soil and in the same party.”

Continue reading latest post (oct 24th 06) on

DR Mahathir CLARIFIES & ELABORATES in 2nd PRESS CONFERENCE: NO ULTIMATUM or TIME FRAME SET For Issues with Pak Lah; Full Transcript; Criticize Things Don’t Benefit Country & MALAYS in Particular

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